Frame with motor/s, but without harness/batteries:
OpenPPG 21lbs
Paracell simplify 23 lbs
Pluma 20 lbs
1 Like
I know ADVENTURE, the owner is a friend I used to be a dealer. My school is still listed on the SIMPLIFY website but I do not represent them anymore.
I still do not understand your question. My electric machine with 4 motors is an OpenPPG (batch2). Are you asking if I can fly it without the batteries? What would be the point of doing that? I fly with 2 or 4 Bonka packs depending on the type of flying I will do on any specific day (wind speed). I am not interested in powered flight only. The OpenPPG is just a means to an end to reach dynamic lift and continue without power. In my case it takes about 15 to 20 seconds after taking off from the ground to hook the elevator at the top of the ridge. Another advantage of the OpenPPG is that it enables me to cross gaps impossible to fly over without power before reaching the lift again on the other side and continue in PG mode.
Here’s is a 2 Bonka flight OpenPPG MAIDEN FLIGHT - YouTube
2 Likes
Sorry it was rhetorical. Withdrawn.
Dudek Universal 1.1 e-ppg electric paramotor DIY EPPG motorschirm carbon paramotor
This guy is flying with the REX 30 motor as well and a 3-blade prop… 85kg pilot / 26m2 Dudek Universal.
Great that he embedded the metrics into this video!
He is flying very low and needs over 5000 watt for level flying and 10000 watt for launching…
He says he is averaging 95 A with 14S = 4921 watt
OpenPPG 12S KV180 with 22x10 prop avg. = 6356 watt
OpenPPG 14S KV150 with 22x10 prop avg. = 6352 watt
The best number I saw was with the Simplify Paracell / Pilot under 80kg
and two blade prop they avg. 4662 watts…
Theoretically the OpenPPG KV150 12S with 27x13 prop’s could average as well 4660 watts.
The problem is that the cage is already 150cm and would be too small! This would need mayor modifications and i am not sure if it is worth…
1 Like
It’s probably also worth noting that this is clearly cold weather figures, there’s snow on the ground. Cold air is denser than warm air which will improve the performance of both the wing and the propeller.
1 Like
…and reduce the performance of the batteries somewhat?
1 Like
It will only reduce battery performance if you start with them cold… like when I left them in my car all day before a winter flight. During use they naturally stay warm.
3 Likes
I wasn’t referring to the batteries being cold. I am talking about wing and propeller efficiencies. When the air temperature is low the air is generally denser than when the air is warm. We know this, that’s why thermals go up! We also know that the action of the moving atmospheric gasses on the airfoil shape of the wing is how our paragliders produce lift. If those atmospheric gasses are ‘thicker’ ie. there are more molecules of gas in each cubic centimetre, more molecules of gas acting on the wing surface, then a bit more lift is produced at the same airspeed. Same goes for the propellers. If you’ve got a small local ridge that you’ve dynamically flown for years you’ve possibly noticed that in the winter altitudes above TO are a bit better than in summer at the same windspeed. At the moment I’m doing a lot of gyroplane flying (which may be why I can’t justify spending out on an OpenPPG to the missus) here in Australia. In winter the air temperature is around 10C and I can easily fly with a 120kg passenger. In Summer at 35C I’d be reluctant to carry over 90kg because my climb rate would be so poor. Though part of that is also that the motors power output will also drop because the less dense air results in less oxygen molecules in each piston stoke and therefore less explosive power… at least that’s something that won’t happen to your electric motors!
Paul
1 Like
I’ve experienced this with model airplanes. A battery that normally powers the plane quite adequately in the summer has barely enough output to get it airborne (just enough to crash into a fence) when the temps are close to freezing. But the small model batteries chill pretty quickly. We learned to keep them in our pockets. 22amp-hour 6 cell Bonkas are a bit big for that.
2 Likes
Since I live in a pretty cold climate I plan to make a sleeve for my lithium ion pack to insulate it in the winter. If you keep pack warm just before flight and have it insulated it stay warm during use and shouldn’t have much loss in energy. I don’t plan to fly in -30c but maybe down to -10
3 Likes
hi, if you fly food drags and the underground is not flat you have to work a lot with gas exchange and the brake on the wing to constantly follow the ground. this causes the wing has more angle of attack and and about 0.3-05 m / sec sink more self. this leads to increased consumption during flight. compared in level you need about 4.2 kw in this konfiguartion. at foodrags about 20% more to fly safely. if you still flies foodrag curves, the buoyancy of the wing sinks even more due to the inclination. Also, the braking effect and the lateral push even more. therefore, every one of those fooddrags like in the video needs more power, no matter if it’s 2-stroke or electric drive. to note is also: in order not to climb up takes away gas. in order not to get too close to the ground you give gas. This interaction also requires a bit more power. On frozen lakes or sports fields it is much easier because they are straight. There you can fly with less brake and gas change. my 2 cents to it. regards
1 Like
Das bist Du in dem Video? Keep up the good work you do…
yes I am. the e-ppg in the video is from 2012. since then i have built some other concepts mainly purely for thermic flying. here is the current value in the level with low EN-B wings at 3.2 kw. with my new folding propeller it will soon be 3-3,2 kw. your picture of the 2 motor concept by hannes is over 10 years old. Back then there was no choice of e-motors and esc. That’s why he built the 2 mot system. today, with thousands of flights, we know that the highest efficiency comes only from a propeller surface of at least 1.3 m2. a ring (duced fan) around the propeller does not bring much out of more resistance therefore worse in overall efficiency. In 2017 I built one for my trike. It is better to build the ends of the propeller to almost zero so that the induced resistance is low. and very quiet! who likes can come to the airfield greiling in germany in 2020 there is a big meeting for electric flight. Maybe we will do there a competition similar to 2018 in Austria. regards
1 Like
in the picture you can see javier (paracell) on the left and me on the right. javier won the competition in austria. simply as a general information: at that time we were flown according to the rule that you can consume a maximum of 1.5 kw / h. this was evaluated with special loggers as well as the gps. in the category longest airtime with 1.5 kw / h (minimum height 150 meters above ground had to be complied with) was the best 32 minutes of the average for the other 24 minutes. in the category highest altitude with 1.5 kw / h was the best with 860 meters above ground. the average was about 650-750 meters. start altitude was 450 m msl. temp. So about 15 to 20 degrees. Wind alternately between 5 and 20 km / h. 1 pilot could not be scored that the logg device has failed in a misadventure of the pilot at the start preparations. this pilot flew 2 hours and 48 minutes in the task longest flight time. he flew his construction the e-walk from germany. He is one of the most experienced pilots worldwide. I tell it for the reason that we hobby pilots have then seen that we should still practice thermic practice. Of course, in the background there are also pilots who fly with e-ppg already over 6 hours in thermal or 100 km fai triangles in the flat country. if there are competitions in the future, everyone is invited no matter which eppg he flies. The only requirement is a valid license and liability insurance.
2 Likes
If you want to see it, a flight on time. the next task will be in a few weeks flight to over 6000ft on start place. (9500 ft msl are legal for us in austria)
2 Likes
Sweet. What’s the weight of the batteries on that flight?
This system I built so that I weigh with battery weight: 40 Ah (11kg) or 80Ah (22 kg) or 120 Ah (33kg) can fly. the suspension point is always the same. I do not have to change that. in flight in the video, I had 120 Ah while the 33 kg battery.
the e-ppg weighs: frame 2.7kg / harness 3.4kg / motor 3.5kg / ESC and cable complete 1.2kg / propeller 0.38kg / shaft and adapter 0.27kg / screws, base plate, battery holders 1.1 kg
That’s about 13 kg total with the protective net and throttle grip.
That means in flight in the video I had a total of 46 kg. In addition, the rescue parachute comes to me 2.4 kg. This is very easy to wear because it is right in my body’s mid-axis, so it does not hang back like petrol engines. you can walk normally with it. But most of the time I fly with 80 Ah that’s 35 kg and 45 -50 minutes flying time. For Funfliegst, Footdrags, etc. I fly with 40 Ah that is then 24 kg and 20 -25 minutes depending on the flying style.
I myself weigh 86 kg. I used the Epsilon 9 in size 30 as a wing. otherwise I usually fly the ion 4 in size M.
here’s a video of the summer. It was very nice for us to be invited there. Otherwise you can not fly there with ppg. an exception was made for us with e-ppg. The nicest thing was we were even paid for the fly incl hotel costs, travel costs 
Elektro Paragleiter Motorschirm E-Trike Thermikaufstiegshilfe E-PPG electric paraglider - YouTube
for the people who are interested in seeing the scientific aspect of propellers. on page 21 you can clearly see how our experience of diameter and blade speed are similar. https://www.mh-aerotools.de/company/paper_15/Hepperle%20-%20Elektrisches%20Fliegen%20Stuttgart%202015.pdf
Many ask me why I do not fly with 20 or 24 cells in series batteries? That’s easy to explain. It would not change the overall wattage. It is also easier to design a motor in the 3.5 kg range which has a maximum efficiency of around 50-60 volts. If you would wind the motor so that it needs 100 volts or more to reach the speed, it is very many extra thin windings then only half of the amperage may get. that’s the technical side to it. a very crucial point is that there is a limit of 60 volts for battery-powered applications in europe, which can come into contact with people. If you had wet fingers and touched a 100 or more volts battery on the + and - cables, it could very quickly kill you or cause your heart to fail. It is DC with an incredibly high pulse rate. that means very fine muscle and nerve cells respond immediately if you do not wear protective gloves. I know people who have made special courses to properly understand e-cars in case of repair or accident damage with regard to the voltage of the individual battery modules. If you were to touch the voltage at the input of the controller of an e car, it would be deadly immediately. Everything is possible to build. you just have to do everything right. then it is ok, of course.
1 Like